Volunteer, Ask, And Accept Support

Ron 0:00

What you're about to hear is a conversation from almost two years ago, but I think it was one of the most meaningful conversations I've ever had.

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Because I have something I'm passionate about and working toward, and I can see how I'm bettering other people's lives, like that's what fill like fulfills people. And when I hear, when I talk to people who like feel like something's missing in their lives, my first response to them is go volunteer. Like that will fix so many of your problems if you volunteer with someone. Can be anyone. Go to a food bank, go to a homeless shelter, go, you know, whatever. Go foster kittens. Like do something that fills your soul and your cup and inspires you to do more. And that's gonna help you. So like that helps your mental health, your physical health, like everything, you know, and it helps other people.

SPEAKER_03 0:47

Ask for help. If there's anything I can even say on this podcast today is ask. There's people, just let yourself be helped. Can you just do that? Put your ego away, put your insecurities away. People are dying to help. All you gotta do is ask. And I don't think enough of us do. And when you do, oh my goodness, it's like the floodgates of the damn drop, and all this support comes pouring through, and all this love, and you're like, where have you been my whole life? And why was I so stubborn? And why was I so admin about believing that nobody's got me? Everybody's got you, especially in the motorcycle community.

Ron 1:41

People

Why Motorcycle Service Matters

Ron 1:42

sometimes ask me what or who inspires me to host the Peace Love Moto podcast. Well, of course, a big part of it comes down to my own love for motorcycling and what that experience does for me, both mentally and physically. But just as much, I'm deeply inspired by the incredible people that this podcast has allowed me to meet along the way. Today, I'm revisiting a conversation from nearly two years ago that has stuck with me ever since. It features two remarkable women who don't just ride motorcycles, but they have a passion. And they demonstrate a passion for love for other people. They're like this force of kindness and healing through community service. In this special combined episode, you'll hear the full visit with Kiki Azim and Kirsten Madura. Kiki is the founder of Rebels with the Cause, organizing humanitarian motorcycle tours through Pakistan that directly impact local village schools, provide wheelchairs for disabled individuals, and uplift families. And Kirsten is the driving force behind engines for change, using the motorcycling community to champion grassroots social impact, sustainability, and disaster recovery around the world. Their positive spirit and dedication, well, that's contagious. And they remind us, they remind me that writing isn't just about seeking our personal peace of mind. I mean it is, but there can be so much more to it. It can also be a vehicle for connection with others, demonstrating love for others and really, really making the world a better place. So relax, settle in, and be prepared to be inspired by Kiki and Kirsten. Stay tuned. What a gift. You know, it's very likely that someone, your parents, your friends, whomever, gave you that opportunity. Others who love you gave you that gift. Food to eat, an education, encouragement, whatever. You possess a gift of time, funds, and health if you ride a motorcycle, and that motorcycle very likely takes you to your happy place. And that's awesome. What about others? The less fortunate here in the US and around the world. Who cares for them? Who wants them to be happy and to experience the joys that maybe you've been able to experience? For that matter, who makes efforts to rescue our planet? The forest, our oceans? Well, I know two people. Two female motorcycle riders who do just that. And we'll meet them today. Today you'll hear part one of my fascinating conversation with Kiki Azim and Kirsten Madura. Two friends with a common heart. A common love for motorcycling for sure, just like me, and a passion for healing a very hurting world. You met Kirsten already in episode 49, and it was then that Kirsten told me about her amazing friend, Kiki. I know that you'll enjoy this conversation between two friends who, yes, love motorcycling, but frankly, they make the world a better place, too. Stay tuned. Recorded

Meet Kiki And Kirsten

Ron 5:47

in beautiful, lovely Colorado. Welcome to Peace Love Moto, the podcast for motorcyclists seeking that peaceful, easy feeling as we cruise through this life together. Are you ready? Let's go. Well, on the Peace Love Motor podcast, it's just a pleasure to meet people that I'd like to hang around with, not only go for a motorcycle ride, but have a coffee with and have a long conversation because we already have so much in common. Uh, I would like to introduce to everyone today, Kiki and Kirsten, two people that I so admire. Kirsten and I have already had a conversation, and it's one of the earlier podcast numbers. I don't have the number in front of me, but it was a wonderful conversation, and we went deep into that conversation about the joy of motorcycling, the needs in the world, and best yet, what can we do? What can we do for solutions? And she introduced me to Kiki, who is on with us today, too. I've learned about you from afar as well. You're also the same thing, that just a wonderful heart. Just have such a heart for others and also happen to love motorcycles. So welcome to you both. I'm so glad to be with you today.

SPEAKER_01 7:04

Thank you, Ron. It's so wonderful to see your sweet, beaming face today.

Ron 7:09

We are on video together. And before we started recording, I introduced you both to my wife, who's my partner in crime for the last 40 years or so over here. But uh so glad you got to meet Karen. But well, let's just start. I know that you both have your own stories, but you blended together as well. And Kirsten, we kind of talked about how you began in an earlier podcast. And I want to circle back to that too.

Kiki’s Pakistan Roots And Gratitude

Ron 7:32

But Kiki, one of the things that I asked Kirsten was what is it your family background or what? What has driven you to do what you do today? Not only motorcycle riding, you know, I'm interested in that history too, but to have the heart for what you what you do. And then I want to go into what you actually do.

SPEAKER_03 7:52

Well, I grew up in Pakistan. I was born and raised there. So, you know, I mean, life is definitely not handed to you on a silver platter there. You are, unfortunately or fortunately, you witness a lot of poverty, a lot of illness. I myself was very sick all the time. And, you know, I mean, my mother and parents, as far as background is concerned, always told me you will forever be unhappy if you compare yourself with those who have more. Always compare yourself to those who have less because it is just blessings on blessings on blessings that we have, right? I mean, the gratitude aspect in in life in general is what gets you through. And that's I think the one thing that I practice the most is gratitude. And that's why I'm always happy. Because we have so much endless blessings to to to count and to be, you know, so so happy about. And you're like, what are you complaining about really? So, you know, and also another thing like if you go somewhere, believe it better than you find it. So, as a kid, I was already in advertised commercials and things like PSAs for the environment and stuff, just to you know, clean up Pakistan, clean up your surroundings, start small, help those around you first. Start with that small circle, right? Everyone thinks so big, you get nothing done, baby. So that's what mama said. She's like, start with the people who are closest to you, right? And work your way up. And we forget that every day of your life. So yeah, I I I always, you know, felt for those who had less, I was always my heart still hurts when I see any I live on Skid Row, so I I'm on the cusp of it. I'm in a building, and they are on the other side of it. So it's it's it's it's very much there. It's you see it every day, full frontal, and it never stops. And you're like, okay, how can I be part of the solution and not part of the problem? That's it. You wake up, right, Kirsten, and you're like, How can I make this better?

Ron 10:10

And

Tragedy That Sparked Riding

Ron 10:11

just like Kirsten, directly or and indirectly, you involve motorcycles into this thing too a number of times. Where did the whole motorcycling thing start for you?

SPEAKER_03 10:24

For me? Yeah. Oh it's a it's a really tragic story.

Ron 10:31

Oh, I don't know where we're gonna go there. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 10:33

Oh, yeah, it's tragic. Oh god, we're getting deep early.

Ron 10:37

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 10:39

I love it because again, I saw it as a blessing. I was unfortunately in in a collision where which took the life of a motorcyclist many years ago in a duck in a tunnel in Italy, and and that was the first time I was like, just left us. And why was he riding? Why do people ride? I'd always be like, ride motorcycles, it's so dangerous, it's so messed up. Like you could die so easily, and there you have it. You know, I was like, oh god, he just gone. And I'm like, there must be something.

SPEAKER_02 11:15

I gotta dig deeper. Oh right.

SPEAKER_03 11:18

And then I wanted to have homage to him. And and so I was like, okay, before I'm 30, I'm gonna get my driving license or my I did I didn't drive either.

SPEAKER_02 11:28

I still don't drive, I just ride. Yeah, driving's overrated, especially in LA. I don't want to ever be in a car, but they're like, I will teach you. And I was like, please don't teach me how to drive.

SPEAKER_03 11:41

Don't teach me how to die or drive, but yeah. I promised that you know, before my 30th birthday, I would learn to ride and get my license and for his spirit to continue riding with me. So out of something like super tragic, like I said, I used it to you can turn it in a way where you're like, okay, this can be turned into positivity. And that's literally what got me into motorcycles. And then I'm like, this is fun.

Ron 12:10

Oh, yeah. But you know, isn't it interesting? It's it's some people don't get it at all. Like, take one ride. Oh, don't want that. You know, and it you either get it or you don't, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Yeah, it's definitely not for everyone, but I do think that there's an element of fear in terms of like a lack of support and a lack of capability, you know, sort of imposter syndrome for a lot of people that I meet, especially newer writers. You know, maybe they'll take the class and then there won't be any support system for them getting out of the class. So they stop writing, or they take the initial course and they feel like it goes too fast. I have a very good friend in New York who took like one day of one of the classes. She did, she accidentally wheelied and then landed the wheelie and was totally fine. And the instructors were like, that was awesome! Like, yeah. And she's like, No, if I'm doing that, like on day one, I'm like, this is not for me. And she just got scared off of it. And then we kind of taught her how to ride a few years later, like, you know, do some of the initial stuff, and she did just fine. But she still just has that like, I don't, uh like, I'm not gonna go there. This feels too dangerous, like even at the start, type of thing. So it's not for everyone.

Kirsten’s Origin Story And Engines

Ron 13:22

Hey, going down that path, Kirsten, you mentioned New York. And when you and I first talked, I I mentioned that I had stalked you on YouTube, kind of, because I I found your video based on my interest in the Distinguished Gentleman's Ride and your video called The Search, which I've watched it multiple times. I think it's wonderful. So well done. Would you mind was sharing with the audience if they haven't listened to the previous interview? Yeah kind of where that story comes from and then your connection into motorcycling also.

SPEAKER_00 13:55

Sure. Yeah, I'll give you the high-level version because as you mentioned, it is detailed very in-depth in the search, which is a stories of bike DGR rider video done by Cam Elkins. And there are also some articles online. If you look on the Engines for Change website, like my origin stories on there as well. But basically for me, I started writing when I was living in Nicaragua, doing some community development work there. My background is in international development and renewable energy and sustainability and environment. So I was living in Nicaragua, rolling out a grant, doing like solar panels on people's homes and things of that nature. And anytime I traveled anywhere that was outside of a job site, like by myself, I needed to get around. And the only ways to do it really were either renting a scooter or a dirt bike. Uh, there's not really public transportation. Renting a car is insane. You know, the buses go so infrequently it's and are kind of dangerous, but you know, I made it work. But I didn't know how to ride a dirt bike. So I'd rent a scooter and I'd be going off on these crazy dirt trails on this little like 50cc scooter that I had no business being on there. I was like, this is so impractical. If I'm gonna stay and keep doing this type of work, I need to learn how to ride. And then once I started riding and kind of connected the dots, I was like, wow, everywhere in the world, except for the US, motorcycles are just a way of life. It's how people get around. It's the most affordable form of transportation that's really, you know, able to get you to different places. It's more capable than a bicycle, it's less expensive than a truck. You know, it can fit in some countries your entire family, you know, depending on who you are and how you want to do it. So it's really just a real-world solution for so many issues around the world. And when I got to New York, I started getting very involved in the New York motorcycling scene, doing events, running my own events, things of that nature. And I just saw how altruistic the motorcycle community is and how much they really want to give back and have a reason to ride. And so, you know, coming from a background in community development and nonprofit work, I was like, well, guess this is the niche that I'm gonna fill now. So Engines for Change initially started as a beach cleanup because, you know, with my environmental background, that seemed like the easiest lift at the start. And then when the pandemic hit, we started mobilizing motorcyclists around New York City to deliver services like face masks, face shields, hand sanitizer, things like that to frontline workers because there was no distribution system happening in New York City. And then that led to us getting involved in other community events and rolling out nationwide, you know, food drives and voter awareness campaigns and things of that nature. And it kind of just evolved from there. So this year really has been kind of a big focus on rolling out the international component of it of that. And Kiki's been running Rebels with the Cause for the last few years. Now I'll let her talk a little bit more about that. But part of why I set this up was to be able to support people within the community who are doing these really cool projects and, you know, using this tool for good, but don't necessarily want to go through the process of setting up their own nonprofit and doing all the paperwork and, you know, all of that type of thing, or like the grant, you know. And since that's what I have a background in, I'm like, well, fiscal sponsorship is something that we can offer to community members who just want to do the impact work and don't want to do all that paperwork and whatnot. So that's that is one of the services that we provide to the motorcycling community is fiscal sponsorship for programs like Kiki's. And I'll let her talk about what she's doing. But it's one of my favorite things that Engines for Change has ever done is collaborated with Rebels with the Cause.

Ron 17:29

So cool. And and I want to go into details on both of the or the multiple things that you guys are involved with, but how did you meet?

SPEAKER_00 17:38

I didn't meet no idea. Maybe the one show?

SPEAKER_03 17:44

I think it was the one show. Was it when Shelly was here? I mean, I saw you because we have so many mutual friends. That's another thing. Yes, we met through Shelly. Shelly, all these people, the best human beings.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

The motorcycle community is so small, especially when you start working in it. Like you just meet all these industry people who like maybe work in it or like industry adjacent. But once you find the people who are like out there just doing the work and like rolling up their sleeves, you're like, oh, they're my people. We're gonna work together. That's gonna happen. So yeah. So, you know, connections and events and the one motorcycle show here in Portland is like a great, you know, hotbed of industry folks. So really good to meet people here.

SPEAKER_03 18:27

But yeah, it's almost it's almost it's international. Like you meet everybody, it's is my favorite show in the whole world. So it's partially my favorite because I met Kirsten over there. So yeah, but um, but yeah, that's I think yeah, that's where we officially met, but we had been gravitating, gravitating, is that a word? Yeah, like we're in the same circles for more and it was uh yeah, it was meant to be, really was. And that was the one Moto show, and then two Motor uh two shows later, she's like, I'm coming on your trip, Pakistan.

SPEAKER_02 19:03

Oh well.

SPEAKER_03 19:10

And and that was just this year's 2024. And I started in 21. So this year will be the fourth.

What Rebels With The Cause Does

Ron 19:17

Can we talk about that? Uh about the uh the rebels with a cause and and what it does. What do you want to what does it do today? What's the opportunity? And because I I very much believe, and we talked a little bit about this before we started recording. I believe so many the people that listen to this podcast are pretty much on the same mindset of yeah, we love to ride motorcycles, but there's more to it than that. You know, okay, I want to preach for a second. So peace, the peace love motor, peace is about peace of mind. We're all seeking that, everybody's seeking that, whether you ride a motorcycle or not. It for people who don't find it, it it's killing them and they're killing themselves or whatever. You know, bad things are happening, bad things are happening to families because mom and dad don't have peace of mind, you know, whatever. So they're seeking that. So peace is what part of the part of the podcast is about. The other part of the podcast is love, love for yourself, which is related to the peace thing, but love for other people, whether it's random acts of kindness or something that is very well, very thoroughly thought out, and it's a big deal, like you guys do. That's what this whole podcast is about. And the the motorcycling thing just happens to be a thread. It could be sailing or tennis for that matter.

SPEAKER_00 20:29

That's funny. I both sail and play tennis, so we can do that, we can talk about that.

Ron 20:34

You just check all the boxes.

SPEAKER_00 20:36

I do. It's my James Bond skill set, you know. He's not lying. You can laugh, Ron. She ain't lying.

SPEAKER_02 20:43

I've got a few of them.

Ron 20:45

Well, I went off on a tangent there, but but tell me more about okay, your connection through the Rebels with a cause.

SPEAKER_03 20:52

Well, rebels started a couple of years ago. I had I wanted to do something to give back to my community, but motorcycle community, and also give back to my community in Pakistan because that's where I I was born and raised. And uh, and like I said, it wasn't easy growing up there, and that's what formed my passion for is the word altruist? Is that altruism?

SPEAKER_04 21:17

Altruism, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:19

And just to always, yeah, kill people with kindness, honey. That's it, you know. Like just do good, like just just why wake up, you know, don't choose violence, like don't choose for all the listeners out there.

Ron 21:32

He's holding up a kitten, which is of course, of course, that yeah, which makes perfect sense for someone like her to adopt uh rescue kittens. So we wrong she fosters them.

SPEAKER_03 21:44

They're part of my healing protocol. But yeah, I started Rebels because I wanted to, I was getting sicker and sicker. For those who don't know, I have been battling chronic Lyme disease and autoimmune illness for many, many decades. I was able to have. The fibromyalgia for a good 11, 12 years. I was writing and doing all the things all the time. Even I didn't let any of the symptoms, you know, make life unbearable for myself. I was just like, uh-uh, I got this. I'm gonna be fine. Everything's gonna be all right. There's people who have it worse. There you go, you know. So what was I say? What were we talking about? That's another thing. We're talking about change of software.

SPEAKER_00 22:26

We're talking about giving back to Pakistan.

SPEAKER_03 22:29

Yeah, so I was just getting sicker and sicker, and I'm like, damn. I am I kept on saying, Oh, once I'm better, I'm gonna do this. Once I'm I can write again, because I I can't ride anymore for the past few years for now. Again, changing the way I speak about it. Like, this is temporary. This is good, this is not forever. This doesn't mean it's the end all. I was just like, okay, I ain't getting better, so I'm just gonna do it. That's all we have is right here, right now. That's another thing. People are like, you know, thinking like way in the future, we're still stuck in the freaking past. And I'm just like, I got today. What am I gonna do with today? Forget five years from now, forget five months from now. What am I doing right here, right now? And what difference can I make right here, right now? So I was like, okay, I'm not getting better, I'm just gonna do it. And so, and it just takes one person. That one person then becomes two, seven, eleven, twenty five, thirty, a hundred. It's magic. So, yeah, I started Rebels with the Cause in 2021 with the help of my friend Lana Killer. She started Women's Moto Exhibit, like one of the first ones who was shooting women in motorcycling many, many years ago. She empowered our community big time, and and so yeah, she pushed me because of course I wasn't gonna do this on my own because I suck sometimes, but yeah, uh, we all suck sometimes. I just procrastinate so hard, and I'm just like, why would I do that? Like, I can't do this alone, like you know, doesn't it?

Ron 24:12

I mean, this is a huge risk for you financially, time-wise, health-wise, everything, and you do it anyway.

SPEAKER_03 24:19

Yeah, everyone was like, Are you crazy? How do you single-handedly do this when you have, you know, uh you're in an IV clinic seven, eight hours a week, you've got treatments every day, you can barely work, you can barely actually, you don't even socialize. What are you doing? This is gonna kill you. And I was like, it's gonna kill me good because it just like again, it's gonna kill me with kindness. It's gonna, it's gonna. I say this after every tour. I say soul, soul rich, body broke, and I mean broken, but also broke. Like, I am out, I have nothing left in my energy bank account, in my physical bank account. It is broke, but my soul is basking in all the riches. So that keeps me going. That's actually it, right? When you see the difference you make, you're like, I can't give up, I can't stop now. Uh-oh. Right, Kirsten? You just can't. You're just like, uh-uh. I started this thing, and now I want to share it, and I want more people on it, and I want to raise funds for it, and I want the kids to like know that they don't have to get married at the age of nine or eleven or you know, 14. I sit there with the girls every year, and just at the schools that we help, and I'm like, you know, you don't need a man, you know you can provide for your family all by yourself. So it really is about just empowering the children, empowering the kids, the communities, the women over there in Pakistan. They're the ones who need it the most, and also a lot of the the the disabled communities.

Wheelchairs, Schools, And Women’s Empowerment

Ron 26:04

So I mean, I've seen one of your videos, and there's a man with no legs.

SPEAKER_03 26:11

Yeah, he he was so stoked. You know the first thing he said to me when he got that wheelchair? He's like, Yeah, now I can start dating.

SPEAKER_04 26:23

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

But that's such an important point on so many levels, right? Is that like you we this, I think motorcycles are the perfect analogy for this, right? People look at these things and they make all these assumptions about what that thing is meant for. What is a motorcycle meant for? Well, it's meant for a weekend hobby. It's meant to, you know, whatever, go out, it's meant to be loud and show off. And then you see how people are actually using them. You see places around the world where they're used for women's empowerment. There's a group in Kenya that there's a STEM school, like a like science, technology, technology, engineering, math school, where it's specifically for women. And then if they can pass the like national testing level, then they can get these scholarships to go to college, which then makes them employable, which means that they can not marry at the age of nine and can provide for their families. But in order for the girls to even go to the school, they need to walk sometimes two hours every morning because school starts at 7 a.m. So they have to leave their houses at 5 a.m. to get there, right? So there's this group called the Boda girls in Kenya that uses motorcycles and they're they're women who ride them and they go pick up the students and they transport them to the school in Kenya so that they can get an education, so that they can pass the national test, so that they can get a scholarship, so they can go to college and become employable. And a motorcycle makes that happen. People make such like wild assumptions about things like wheelchairs, and they're like, oh, wheelchairs are for accessibility, so you can get from point A to point B. But to hear that like somebody's excited because they will be considered a viable option for a date because they're in a wheelchair, like this is this is like the whole reason why I love working on projects like this is because you tell somebody one of those anecdotal stories, it blows their freaking minds. They're like, I never thought of it that way. I never thought that motorcycles were a tool for development and mobility and empowerment and so on and so forth. And you're like, yeah, because nobody's put that story in front of you. Like you've no, you haven't experienced it yourself. You haven't talked to people who have experienced it. And that's what I love so much about Pakistan and like Kiki's program is like before I had heard about Pakistan once before from the Chickistan tour run by another woman, Liza Miller, which is an all-women's tour there, which is amazing. And I almost went with her in 2021, I think it was. And my dad was like, no way, I'm disowning you as a daughter. If you go to Pakistan, that place is so dangerous. You're gonna get abducted by terrorists, you're gonna get, you know, all this stuff, like huge fear-mongering because he's an armchair expert, you know, sits and watches the news. And then when I met Kiki and I was like, okay, well, I'm gonna support your program, right? Like we're gonna do this fiscal sponsorship partnership. And I was like, well, I can't be doing this if I haven't gone. Like I have to go. So then I went this year on the tour for the first time. Pakistan is now my number one favorite country. It's just awesome. The people are amazing. I've I felt so safe there. I was so happy to be there. Everybody there is an entrepreneur, everybody's working in sustainability, not because they get funding for it, but because it's the right thing to do. And like, there's just so much potential to keep developing this program with Kiki and keep adding to it. I'm really hoping I'm on the board of a solar nonprofit that does solar projects around the world. I'm really hoping that we can do a solar project in Pakistan with one of the schools that Kiki works with. So there's just so much potential here. And that all starts with a motorcycle and a wheelchair. And it's like people just can't like most people don't make those connections on your own, which is what we're trying to do, you know?

SPEAKER_03 29:51

So yeah, it just it and you know, through through Kristen's work, like I mean, like she said, she can provide these physical sponsorships that allow me to guess what, put all my focus where I need to put it. I don't know how to ask for money, honey, but I know how to how how to like do good and have a good time. So I agree with that. You're an excellent fundraiser.

SPEAKER_00 30:14

And like the Boda Girls program, that program is another fiscal sponsorship partnership with Maya Fox, who runs the Be Nice rally twice a year. And that, I mean, she wanted to put on this event, and I talked to her about ways that she could do it. And that initial conversation was actually done like I just gave her some ideas and we weren't gonna work together. She's like, I'm gonna go do this event. I'm like, fantastic, like do it, you know? And then a year after she started doing it, that's when we started having the conversations about fiscal sponsorship. So it's really cool because some of these things have evolved, but the people that I choose to work with and I choose to support are the ones who have already taken those first steps, not the ones who are necessarily sitting there going, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, you do know what to do. You absolutely like you know what causes you care about, you know people. And if you know like what you need or how to ask for help, then you know, we can do that. Or if you don't know what you need and you don't know how to ask for help, those are the conversations I love having, where I'm like, I will sit down with you and I will brainstorm an idea. But if it's your idea and you're passionate about it, like my expectation is that you're gonna be the one to do it, right? I will support you, but you got to be out there already doing it. And I think that's what really fulfills the people I see, like Kiki, who are like, I can overcome anything because I have something I'm passionate about and working toward, and I can see how I'm bettering other people's lives. Like, that's what fill like fulfills people. And when I hear, when I talk to people who like feel like something's missing in their lives, my first response to them is go volunteer. Like that will fix so many of your problems if you volunteer with someone. Can be anyone, go to a food bank, go to a homeless shelter, go, you know, whatever, go foster kittens, like do something that fills your soul and your cup and inspires you to do more. And that's gonna help you like that helps your mental health, your physical health, like everything, you know, and it helps other people. So yeah, I love that.

SPEAKER_03 32:03

Yeah, nothing's more rewarding than that. And you're right, yeah, you you really were like, do it, and I was doing it, like whether it was the fundraising in whatever way or aspect I could do it, and then the you know, it just started funneling in, and then, but to have support, like to not be alone, that's it. We are a community, and to lean on community and have them like hold you, let them hold you. That's another thing.

SPEAKER_00 32:30

Yeah, yeah. And to your point about how like one person grows into two, grows into five, all of those people are not gonna have the same skill sets. Like, I had no connection to Pakistan, really. So I'm not gonna go roll out a program. They are like, that would be weird and kind of colonial. But having like Kiki has these skill sets in that she knows the communities, she is from there, she has these relationships and connections. And I have connections with the, you know, nonprofit project management, solar grant-making world. Like, you know, those are two things where you can be creative and figure out how they work together. And those are the best projects, are the ones where you're like, I never would have connected those dots. No, but I mean, to your point, like that's you're talking about stereotypes from places, and I think motorcyclists are get that all the time. And I have

Challenging Stereotypes About Pakistan

SPEAKER_00 33:16

like a micro TED talk that I do sometimes on engines for change for people who are outside of the motorcycling community. And what I do is I have people close their eyes and I have them picture a motorcyclist. And again, if you're outside of the moat, like if you're in the motorcycling community, you're gonna picture something different. And if you're in the international development community where you've seen how motorcycles are used around the world, you're probably gonna fit like picture something different. But the average American is gonna picture an old white dude in a leather vest on a Harley. Like, that's what you're gonna picture. So the first thing I do, the first photo I show when they open their eyes is exactly that. But it's a guy from the bikers against child abuse. And so I open on that and I'm like, you're probably picturing something like this. But if you're going like around the world, you picture something like this. And then I show the Boda girls in Kenya, and I show national park rangers in Peru, and I show like all these other people who are riding different types of bikes for different purposes. And then I bring it back around to the bikers against child abuse, and I'm like, this guy, this guy supports children who are coming from trauma backgrounds, right? Who have been, you know, abused by family members, so on and so forth. And they go sit in front of the courtroom, they befriend the children, then they go sit in front of the courtroom and they act as support for the kid when they have to get up and testify against their abuser. So it's a whole group of these burly white dudes on Harleys who sit and women, there are women in it too, but they sit in the front row with their arms crossed, like just a visual support for the kid and intimidation for the abuser to be like, we got this kid's back, you do this again, like it's not gonna be pretty kind of thing. And that just shifts people's mindsets because they're like, I totally picture that. And I'm like, do you know what those people are doing? You don't. And that's like there's a whole history of like MC culture where, like, yes, some of it is violent and reckless, but there's an origin behind it, and there's a lot of community work behind that as well. So it's just the stereotypes are really, really dangerous. And I think Pakistan's a great example of that, right? There's so many stereotypes about what's happening in Pakistan, and you go there and you're like, this place is amazing. I'm gonna, I'm gonna go back every single year. Like, don't come. It's actually terrible. Don't come. Oh, right. So nobody tourists shouldn't come.

SPEAKER_02 35:33

So not so dangerous. Like, please don't come here. It's the best video.

SPEAKER_00 35:40

I mean, I came back, I came back after the trip and I showed my dad photos and I told him stories, and he's like, Wow, Pakistan looks amazing! I'm like, dude, like you don't remember this conversation where you're gonna disown me. Like, come on.

Ron 35:52

So so so that's what it is.

SPEAKER_03 35:55

Yeah, that's rebels. It started with me trying to change so many perspectives. The perspective of like all the people here, every time I go back to Pakistan saying, Oh my god, be safe. And I'm like, bruh, the second I leave LA, I feel the safest in the world. You're like, I live in LA. What do you mean, be safe there? Like, what do you mean? I was like, finally, my nervous system can recalibrate in Pakistan. Like, and then just hearing that over and over, I was like, This is my country. I was like, and you have been like, wow, in the first like few days, people just come on this trip. It's you know, a lot of it's a tour, it's a humanitarian motorcycle tour. I have people who come because they love all the things I love, you know, epic landscapes, doing good, being on a bike, freedom of the open road, all of that. They have been lied to and conditioned by our government for the past I don't know how many decades. And I was like, you and me both, baby. Like, there was once an anecdote about a guy on a durban, he was washing his cow, and he was like asking us to like I saw him and I was like, ugh, like maybe don't go down that alley, Kiki. And I'm like, back up, why am I thinking like that? The guy then asked us all to come to his home for lemonade, like, because he was like, You must be so overhoot heated with all your gear and stuff. Let me make you lemonade. And I'm like, bad, bad key. You weren't even born and raised in America, and you had let the news get to you. You got the all those movies that all the baddies have beards and have turbans and are brown skinned. You let that affect you and change your insight on your people. I felt so much shame in that moment, but I use that shame again for like, all right, scratch that. You new canvas, uh-uh. I'm not gonna let I'm gonna make my own decisions, I'm gonna make my own opinions on the environment that I'm in, the people that I meet. And then everybody else goes along with it, and it's like, whoa. I'm like, yeah, brother.

unknown 38:10

Whoa.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

I mean, and it's so much it also speaks to like we're all human, we're all fallible, we're all susceptible to marketing, we're all susceptible to propaganda. Like, we think we're above it, but we're not. And the only way to like figure that out and overcome it is either to do it yourself, which I understand, like that that's a big jump for a lot of people. But if you know people who have gone, like I've known, I know multiple people at this point who have gone to Pakistan, and every single one of them comes back and is like, oh my God, that was an amazing, incredible experience. I have not heard a single person come back and say, I was scared for my life, I was uncomfortable. I mean, there's, yeah, sometimes like you might eat something like that makes you a little bit sick, or yes, it's a motorcycle tour. Like people crash, you know, like you can't, you can't handhold everyone, you can't put everyone on the back of a bike, but it's never the people, it's never the culture, it's never, you know, like none of that is problematic. You don't run into insane scenarios that you're picturing. I it's not to say it couldn't happen, but I have never heard a story of that happening. So, and also the tour doesn't go to like the places that are war like war zones. So yeah, yeah. Well, yeah, I mean, they're exciting enough for me to know we got enough stuff to worry about with like 12 riders through you know, the city through Scarto.

Ron 39:32

US, it's the bad news that makes the news, like they used to use the expression bad news sells soap, you know, you know, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 39:40

And well, that's why it's good that you're doing this podcast, you know. Tell me, yeah, exactly.

Ron 39:44

I mean, we know. I mean, just in this the community that I focus on is the one I know here in the US, and especially the Western United United States, is where I know they're wonderful people out in the middle of the woods who never see anybody, but you know, they're just the sweetest people in the world, and it's that's the great majority. They don't make the news. Nobody gets that. It's like it's like, well, again, I'm getting off on a tangent. People will will that are from where I grew up in McKinney, Texas, they'll say, How do you handle the winter in Colorado? You're just buried with snow all the time. I ride my motorcycle almost every day because it warm, it does warm up. The sun is really bright, you know. So it's just these perspectives that you can't fix until they get here. And when they get here, it's like, wow, people are really nice here. Nobody, they're not tailgating at all. Well, you know, in this area where I live.

SPEAKER_00 40:33

It's not it's I mean, I'm not gonna lie, I was I was still a little bit nervous going on the trip. Like, you know, I still had some of that fear that my dad had like instilled in me and that, you know, I'd read about online and that kind of stuff. And I was like, I'm doing it. I have I have trust in Kiki, I have trust in the tour operators, like I trust that this is gonna happen, especially since it's been happening for a few years now. So I'm like, all right, so a lot of the kinks have probably been worked out at this point. But I can't say that there wasn't like a little bit of hesitation there where I was like, is this gonna be all are people gonna prove me wrong? Right? Or prove whatever, prove themselves right? And yeah, I'm like, I'm so excited to go back this year. I'm like, there's no hesitation at all. Like, I'm so excited.

Ron 41:16

Wonderful again, maybe another segue, but I work part-time in Rocky Mountain National Park as a tour guide, started doing that on the weekends and stuff. But so we have tourists who come in and they hop in the back of a modified Jeep, about 12 people at a time from all over the place, you know, LA, Miami, whatever, mostly the United States. But they have these pre preconceptions that this is oh, this is like Disneyland. So it's the jungle cruise, and we're gonna be cruising along. Oh, there's an alligator. Oh, there's a stuff. And then I explained to them, we're going out into the real world. The animals don't know the difference between the boundaries for Rocky Mountain National Park and then the National Forest that's all around them. They have no idea. They're all wild, they're all real. And it's it's when they have that aha moment. When I when you know, we we tour guides joke amongst ourselves that one of the things that we hear every once in a while from some from tourists will say, How many animals will we see in this three-hour tour? And then we jokingly say, 'Well, if it's Thursday, we'll see 18. No idea. We may not see a rabbit.

SPEAKER_00 42:18

The thing is, are we counting crows? Because yeah, like 30 of them in one sight area.

Ron 42:24

Sometimes we have to. I guess my point is though, people have to get away from what they're used to, out into this other space and realize that you know what it's really quiet. But wait, it's not so quiet. There's noise all the time. There's wind from this canyon down a mile below us. I can hear the wind down there. And I'd say, listen carefully, listen over here. You're hearing a river that's two miles away because they're not used to the silence. And then they come back a different person. So I guess where I'm segueing there is that I've experienced some similar things, and I'll maybe share a little bit about that later. But it seems like once you step out and you you put all your preconceptions, preconceived notions behind you, and you just step out and say, I trust you. And next thing you know, it's like, oh my gosh, the world is so different than what I thought. So different.

SPEAKER_00 43:13

But having that, having someone to trust is huge. And I realize that a lot of people don't necessarily have that, right? So that's a big part of what we're trying to do is going, okay, you're not going to go do this on your own. And we understand that. But if we can create like a safe space for you to go and push your own boundaries in your own comfort zone and grow from it and help people in the process, then you know that's the goal, is like is is becoming that safe space.

Ron 43:39

That gets to the whole point of many points where I wanted to talk with you both. I want people to know that you're real people. You know, you're you're great in a lot of ways, you're flawed in other ways, just like everybody else, but you've seen something and experienced. Really?

SPEAKER_00 43:52

I only have one flaw.

Ron 43:53

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 43:55

Humility, obviously.

Ron 43:57

Backhand?

SPEAKER_00 44:00

I can't think of any, sorry.

Ron 44:03

But just just knowing, and we'll talk a little bit later. I'm probably not going to record this part of it. We'll talk a little bit later because I have a plan for the Peace Love Moto tour, perhaps. Maybe in the future. We'll see. Talk with you more about that later.

SPEAKER_02 44:16

Okay, yeah. We can we can talk about that. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's just you're full of goodness and and oh I love it.

Ron 44:23

Kiki, though, I think you and I think just alike. And we were talking a little bit again before we kind of before we started recording. But I believe there's a purpose we're here. I really do. I think that there's a reason why I've given up, yeah, I've been given opportunities as I've had. I've worked hard, most definitely. But oh my goodness, I've been I I've failed in a lot of ways. I'm I'm a very flawed person, but I've got two motorcycles in the garage. Oh my goodness. And tomorrow, when it's sunny, even though it might just get up to 45 or whatever, I've got the day off. I can go right downstairs, start up either one of them. A beautiful BMW, a beautiful triumph. I can go for a ride in the Rocky Mountains. And I'm so fortunate, there's gotta be a reason for that. I'm just convinced it's not just chance. I feel like along with this, is not a requirement to do good for other people and to say a kind word or go over the top with a tip or do charity work, whatever. I feel like it's it's an obligation because I've give been given so much. And at the same time, too, I guess here I'm going down another path, but I know of so many, I know of a few wealthy people, you definitely see them on the news, who have everything. They have everything, boatloads of money they don't know what to do with, and they're unhappy or they're killing themselves. You wonder why, because there was this sadness underneath. Where's that all that where did that come from? And I can't help but think that maybe some that listen to this podcast may too have everything going on in the world. Why am I still sad? Why am I still sad? Maybe you just need to open your heart a little bit and take a step out, take a chance, listen to people like you and say, you know what, I'm gonna give this a try. And I'm gonna give and I'm gonna pour myself out there and I'm gonna just listen and see what see what I can learn, see how I can help. And I think that that's gonna cure some of the ills in the world.

Community, Nature, And Mental Health

SPEAKER_00 46:26

I think that what I kind of observe, and I I realize that I'm a little bit biased because I am a community builder, like by trade, but I I feel like individualism and like kind of toxic individualism is what leads people to feel that sadness, right? So you're it's lonely at the top, you're making a bunch of money, you can't relate to anyone, no one relates to you. You feel isolated. You might have a you might be in a huge room of people. I mean, this I kind of felt this way in New York when I first moved there. Like you're there, you're around a ton of people, but you're like, I don't have any real connections necessarily. So are they loving me for my status, my money, my yeah? Yeah, exactly. And and building those deep connections, not only with people, but with nature. Like we've we've strayed so far from being part of the natural world. We think that we're above it and better than it and that it's there to serve us instead of being part of the planet. Like we are we are animals on the planet. We need to live, you know, symbiotically with the other animals on the planet and the plants and the whole thing. But we remove ourselves intentionally and think that we're better and think that we're meant to be stewards of the earth and we're not. Like the like we're we're meant to live with the earth, but not, you know, we're we're not in charge of it. It's not there for us. So, and it's the same thing with community. You know, we I think that's a problem with like sitting in cars, for example, right? Rather than taking public transportation. Like you're sitting there in a box all by yourself, isolated, not even knowing the face of the person who's in front of you in traffic, and you're like, why are you going so slowly? Like you're just angry at like an idea of something. You're angry at a concept. And I'm sure that if you got out of the car and you had a conversation with that person, you'd become like best friends, right? But we intentionally isolate ourselves, whether that's physically speaking, right? The fact that we no longer live with multi-generational housing. We, you know, we don't live in communities and communes. And like I would go crazy if I lived in a commune, but I understand the value of the connection of having like tight-knit communities like that. And kind of straying from motorcycles a little bit, like with the direction that our country's going in, right? And the direction that capitalism is going in and all these big ticket item discussion points that is bringing in like climate change and all the things that are like giving so much anxiety to the average person on a daily basis. The only solution that I have found that I've come to that can help with that is decentralization and community focus, right? So, how do we create local food systems again? So we're not highly dependent on the agricultural, you know, massive like big ag or whatever. Like, how do we find a way to support each other health-wise so we're not highly dependent on the public health system? You know, like are there things that we can do within our communities to keep the services and the connections within the communities? And so, really, that community focus is like that's the only way that I can see us getting through this without all of us coming out of this depressed and suicidal. You know, and that goes for motorcycles too. Like, who are your who are the riders in your area? Like, do can you connect with them? Can you do volunteer days and service days with them? Can you build those connections locally? Obviously, globally is great. Like Kiki and I aren't in the same place, but you know, being able to being able, I do have so many friends here that are motorcyclists that I can like call if I need something. So um, and I think that's really special about the motorcycling community is that we already get that in a way that most communities and most groups don't. Like we get it. We're the first people to pull over on the side of the road for other people. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that kind of thing.

Ron 50:15

I think the a great visual example and a once-a-year example is the distinguished gentleman's ride, where I've described it any number of times. You go, you, you go to the event, you're all dressed up, you're prepared, you're on your classic bike, you go up to a total stranger, give them a hug, then say, hello, my name is because we've got the motorcycling connection and we're raising we're raising funds for a really, really good cause, which is I'm like you, Kiki. I cannot ask for money. I never like to do that at all. But when I turn around and say, it's not about me, it's about this world around us. There are these hurting people, either physically or mentally hurting people. They need us, they need a kind word. Just tell hello, how are you? And genuinely feel that. No, tell them what you may be talking somebody out of, you know, just by well, and it's and it's a two-way street, right?

SPEAKER_00 51:06

Like, I need things, I need, I need hugs, you know, and that kind of thing. And so I think it's really important for people to recognize that this kind of work that we're doing, it's not a one-way street. It's not like we're giving to people and we are saving their lives and that kind of thing. Like, we get stuff out of it too, whether that's a sense of fulfillment, whether that is literal connections. Like, if we're gonna go, like if I go and do this solar program with Kiki on the school, that also helps, you know, progress the nonprofit that I work for. And then we can get funding from that. And like it all starts to go around, like come back around in ways that you may not expect. And I think that it's really important to remember that all of this work that we're doing is interdependent and not top-down.

SPEAKER_01 51:53

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:54

Yeah, I can't do any of this alone, especially with my health and stuff like that. But again, ask for help. If there's anything I can even say on this podcast today, is ask. There's people, just let yourself be held. Can you just do that? Put your ego away, put your insecurities away. People are dying to help. All you gotta do is ask. And I don't think enough of us do. And when you do, oh my goodness, it's like the floodgates of a dam drop, and all this support comes pouring through, and all this love, and you're like, Where have you been my whole life? And why was I so stubborn? And why was I so adamant about believing that nobody's got me? Everybody's got you, especially in the motorcycle community. I am not riding anymore for the past four years. That doesn't mean I'm not gonna ride again, inshallah. I will, but you know what? I still show up, just like that gentleman you spoke of, just like my friends who've lost their legs and can't ride anymore. They still show up, yeah, they still do, and that's why, and everyone still is so happy to have me around, or you know, just because you're unwell, you still show up 10 times more than any of us who are not even sick. Like, Kiki, how do you do it? Like, and I'm like, because I woke up and I'm still breathing. Like, I have so much luck to have like lived through the day, and I am not gonna let this day go by without giving it my all, like my 200%. So, so what's your excuse? What's your excuse, Mr.? I got money, I got help, I got three motorcycles in my garage. Like, dude, let me infect you with proliferation of doing good. Like, like I said, it's a cycle. Like, inspire everyone and and say things now. Don't wait till people are dead. Don't wait, just do it.

Ron 53:53

I've been getting feedback this past year and a half from this podcast. I haven't known really where it's gonna go. It kind of all started with the theme of hey, I like the I like the distinguished gentleman's ride and what it's all about. I love to ride motorcycles. I love to try to be helpful too. And um there's a lot of people just drowning in silence out there. They just don't have the courage or are just uh, you know, introverts or whatever it is to don't know where to look.

SPEAKER_00 54:20

Like it's not it's not necessarily obvious. I mean, especially with like algorithms and stuff these days, like it's hard to get the word out. Like, we don't have, we're all volunteer run. You know, it's hard to do marketing. I'm so right now I'm launching a community motorcycle program in Guatemala. So I'm going out to Guatemala in February to roll this out. And I desperately need to be fundraising for this. But I've been burned out from other things, and I just haven't had like the capacity to to build a pitch deck and send it out to sponsors and build a donation page and all this kind of stuff. And it's like it takes so much work to just get the word out, and it's it, I feel like it's a disservice to the community because there are things going on. And kind of to your guys' point about fundraising, like I too hate, I hate asking for money, but I also realize that I need to start really leaning into it a little bit more. And one thing that I heard recently from I'm gonna do a plug for my friend Calliope, who runs Philanthropy Without Borders. She may, she mentioned that fundraising is you should shift your perspective to thinking about it as inviting people to go on this journey with you, right? As like inviting them to like giving them an opportunity to have their own impact. Like maybe nobody's gonna be able to come down to Guatemala with me. Maybe you can't go to Pakistan for whatever reason, but like you believe in the cause and you want to support it. And so you're like, hey, I understand if you can't come on the trip, but like if you still want to support, like here is your way to get involved. And kind of looking at this, looking at your donors more as partners than as, you know, pockets is probably the best way to approach it. So that's what I'm trying to focus on next year, is really like honestly the fundraising side of things because we are like bootstrapped all the way. And we, I mean, we've had individual donors for certain campaigns. And I am so grateful to those donors who have been able to support that. But, you know, we don't have like regular subscription donations, we don't have money for overhead, like that kind of thing. So it's all out of the kindness of our hearts. So being able to, you know, I there's there is some responsibility on people to go out and try to seek out the opportunities to get involved. Because if it's just coming on a one-way street from the volunteers who just care, like it's the word is gonna be difficult to get out. But but that's also why I'm really grateful for things like this podcast, because you do have subscribers and an audience that Kiki and I might not have already. So being able to do stuff like this is not only fun, it's also super helpful for us.

How Listeners Can Help Right Now

Ron 56:57

Well, that's exactly what I wanted to do. And I, and if I I like to shift gears to get specific, because like I said, there are listeners that I have gotten feedback from who have been helped through this podcast. And I'm absolutely convinced, too, that if they have an opportunity, a clear, relatively simple opportunity in front of them to enjoy your motorcycling hobby, if that's your thing, but also to be part of a greater good that could change your life forever by going and experiencing that. Maybe something they need to do. And that's why I'm gonna have it in the show notes, all the details that you'd like me to share and stuff too. We here at PS Love Moto, we, my wife and I, we've tried to be contributors to both of your causes too. We we we've we've tried to be involved in all that stuff too. But there's a lot of people though that again, you know, may have just tons of money and just tons of time on their hand and a whole garage full of bikes and so sad every day, and they don't know why. Well, try this. That's what I'm that's what I'm thinking. Just you're you're hearing from people you can trust who you're getting to know now. Give it a try. So, how about how about we kind of go this route now? Like back to you, Kiki. What specifically could the listeners of this podcast do to support what your cause is and make something possibly magical happen in their own life?

SPEAKER_03 58:29

There's something very special about what I have been able to do for the past four years, which I've not seen in a lot of nonprofits, is that still to this day, four years later, a hundred percent of my proceeds go to the cause. And it's like real life. Like Ron, the money you you donated, you saw me donate wheelchair to a person. It's full freaking circle. You get to see your donation, your participation full circle. We don't get to see that anymore because of everything. We're just losing everything now. Everything's like being bought up by bigger uh corporations, mom and pop stuff is disappearing, small tradesmen and craftsmen are disappearing. We see it every day. We don't even have to go far to see like our own friends who are metalsmiths, fabricators are out of business. And who's making the big money? The big corporations and who are buying out all these people. But you get to see on such a small scale, but such an intimate scale, that even if you're not on my trip, you're a part of it because I show you from beginning to end where your money went, babe. And that is that's worth all the gold in the world. And that makes you wanna like a friend who sends me like a Venmo. He's like, Here's a hundred bucks, Kiki, do what whatever you want. And I was like, Well, I'm gonna, and then I showed him, I was like, This is my my assistant over there buying buying the wheelchairs, these are the wheelchairs being distributed, these are the wheelchairs like with the people, their names are so and so, and you've changed their lives forever. And he's like, Here's another $200. And this is before I even had an EIN number. So I was like, babe, I can't do anything for you. You can't even get your you know, tax exemption from this. But yeah, everyone's donation now is money you weren't you're giving to rebels, you're not giving to Uncle Sam. And it's all going to like actually palpably change the life of a child, a little girl, a family. You know, you start with wheelchairs and books and crayons and desks, and then you become like, oh my god, solar panels, oh my god, computer labs. I mean, this is game changer, game changer. And this is all thanks to all the rebels. It hasn't been big people from like IBM and so on and so forth who are like, hey, we want to give you this. No, it's my rebels from past tours and current tours who are finding their connections and making this happen. So if you're out there and you work for anything that you think, I mean, we need everything from water filters to to to to money. They don't even care for money, honestly. I give big, nice, big, fat, you know, bills to the teachers because I was focusing so much on the students uh for the past few years and the like the women of the community uh for the children of the community. And I was like, wait, you gotta support their pillars as well, like their main pillars, who are their teachers, who are their daughter's a teacher. They're oh bless her soul. Yeah, oh my god. And I was like, how do I know you have to? They're the ones, and they're giving their valuable free time volunteering at these schools to give these kids an opportunity and a future. So, you know, I mean, a lot of these kids, I mean, suicide is not something wrong that's normal in my culture or my religion. And we started to see a lot of suicide, and we're like, I dig deeper, I ask the community, and they're like the culprit is the literacy rate. Kids are going to school, people are going to school, but they can't after they have no resources after the fact that they've gone to school. They filled up their brains with dreams and desires to like fulfill such wonderful careers, and they're they're so full of life and opportunity, but there is no opportunity. Then they realize you're like, Oh, well, this was a nice stint in my life, and I gotta go back to being a shepherd's son. So, how do we fix that? That has been racking my brains, and then I was like, Oh, computers giving them little windows to the outside world. They speak excellent English, give them jobs, find them jobs, guys. I will say it now. There are women in the north of Pakistan, graphic designers, social media girls, not just girls, children or teenagers, or there's you know, there's people who want to be hired, but they don't have any way of funneling and finding that person who'll hire them. And they, guys, if you want to hire someone who you know it'll be it won't be as expensive as hiring someone here, but you know you can literally sustain the life of an entire family or multiple families in Pakistan by just hiring someone who's freaking IT genius or like graphic design and all of that, do it. I have the means. I will send you around the the the the details. Someone sent me this the other day. He's like, Kiki, can you help? And I was like, I was like, bro, leave me alone. You know, because I was like, I'm in treatment. I was literally like, I had yeah, I was having transfusions and all my treatments, and I'm like, really, really? I already do so much. And and then I was like, I'm so sorry, I wasn't in a good place, but I'm listening and I'll do what I can do. And even if I can't personally do it, I might know somebody who can. And even if it's one person, like we said, Ron, in the beginning of this, when we were waiting for you, Kirsten, we were like, if you can touch one person, you're winning. So yeah. So anyone who wants to help. I mean, I do bikini bike washes, guys, so I'm not really that's another event I'll have to bring my own.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:26

I mean, Kiki's got assets, you know, and she likes she likes to share them, and we love that about her.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:33

Blessings from Allah. I use it, you know. I'm doing the work Sunday through Saturday, honey.

Ron 1:04:41

It's all for the good. It's all for the good. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:44

Yeah, and kind of building off of that. I mean, a lot of people, especially people who we, you know, in the states, I know a lot of people who are pretty well off or work for big companies or things like that. And of course, we appreciate literally any dollar amount. You can donate like a dollar, and we're like, great, we can do something with that. We love that. We're here for it. But there's also an opportunity, like should say, and there's also an opportunity for people to go run campaigns on our behalf in their company, right? And say, hey, this is a cause I really care about. I'm donating a dollar. Can everybody in this 500-person company donate a dollar? And then that turns into 500, right? There are corporate sponsorship opportunities and donation matches that people should be aware of, right? So if you work at Google, you can donate up to a certain amount and submit it to Global Grid Project, who so Engines for Change is a D a legally registered DBA under an organization called Global Grid Project. And Global Grid Project's mission is to provide basic human resources. Yeah, I'll send you all this information too, but basic is provide basic human resources to under resourced communities around the world. And so motorcycles is one of those. Resources. So engines for change and global grid project are the same thing from a legal entity standpoint, just with two different names for clarification. So you can go to your company and you can say, Hey, I'm donating to Global Grid Project. I'm donating $500. And your company, a lot of companies, especially big corporations, will donation match whatever you donate or whatever you raise. So if you get your 500 colleagues or your 10 colleagues or your two colleagues or whatever to donate a certain amount of money, there are often donation matches that are offered by your organization. And I actually, a couple of my friends helped with that. And that is how I was able to fundraise the like $13,000 that it took for me to go to Peru a couple of years ago with Rally for Rangers. A big part of that was being able to fundraise through corporate corporate donation matches. So you can get creative in terms of how to donate and how to fund things and how to sponsor things. And I'm happy to talk to anybody about that if you would like to help fundraise on our behalf. But we have a GiveButter page and we're launching a new website very, very soon, which will make it easier to donate to specifically to Pakistan or to any of the programs that we support. But I think your original question was also like, what can people do? And I I know I've been in the position for a long time working in nonprofits where I'm like, there's so many nonprofits that I care about, but I am financially kind of strapped. So I will donate time. And what does that look like, right? What are those opportunities? I mean, for us, sharing information is huge, like sharing our stories, sharing, you know, a bunch of things. We we're gonna have some organizers that I'm that I'm gonna be working with to roll out a men's mental health program, kind of going back to the DGR conversation, because there are a lot of men, especially out there, who do feel really isolated and have found some com some sense of community through motorcycles, but don't necessarily have the tools to create something a little bit bigger and more formal with that. And so we're gonna be launching a pilot men's health program that's run by men within our community, but then also connecting them with resources like, you know, mental health professionals who can give some, you know, advice and kind of work through some things with them and community organizers, like people who lead these types of things professionally. So so that they it'll be like a train the trainer kind of program so that those individuals can then go back to their communities and have more tools to be able to support their communities. So that's something that like we're rolling out this year. And if people have experience doing that, one of the things that's going to be on the new website is toolkits for how you can be a community organizer and an activist in your own communities. So I need help from people who already have experience doing this or from people who have have no experience doing this, but are willing to try it and document their experiences so that the rest of our motorcycling community can learn from that. And so that I don't have to be the one to go out and organize every single event across the country. Everybody can be empowered to organize their own. So that's kind of some of the stuff that I'm working on right now. And I I would love help with a lot of these things. So if anybody has an idea of something that they're willing to actually do and try out and trial and error, and those are the kinds of people that I could personally use a lot of help and support from.

Ron 1:09:20

You know what I didn't hear from either of you? I didn't hear, and this is how I'm gonna make a lot of money for myself.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:29

Okay.

Ron 1:09:31

That's huge. We've all got to make a living.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:33

Good one, Ron. Yeah.

Ron 1:09:35

In a couple of years, that takes money, you know, in a savings account and all that stuff. And that's that's hard to attain.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:41

But if anybody knows of any capacity building grants or wants to give us a capacity building grant, we would love to be able to be to pay ourselves to focus on this full time. So it's not just a passion project. You can talk to me about that too.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:53

Uh, Rebels Tour will be launching in the next couple of days for next year for 2025. We were just dialing in like the itinerary and all the kinks and the things that we learned from this this summer. You know, it was incredible and incredibly useful to have feedback. Kirsten had like set up something so that every writer could, every rebel could give their their, you know, their yeah, just their feedback from how their experience was. And that was very helpful. And another thing that was really helpful is that like sure, maybe you have like no money and and you want to still help because it's usually the people who have no money want to help. Bizarre. That's so true. So if you want to like go to these schools in Pakistan, or you know, like if you if you if you do metalsmithing and you're like, wouldn't it be cool to go to Pakistan and teach these kids for a month? We will like we will make sure and ensure to set you up. You won't get paid, honey, but you'll get your ass there and you'll be able to be accommodated, and you will have changed the lives of dozens and dozens of children for so many or women or men for time to come. Like, why wouldn't you? Right. So I'm calling out to artists, musicians, go for like a one-month, you know, teaching opportunity, go to Pakistan, they will accommodate you. You won't like it'll be volunteer based, but you'll get accommodation and possibly food because oh god, everyone's trying to feed you there, honey. Everyone's everyone's and the food is so good. It's so good.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:28

I don't why Kristen's actually coming back. Why don't you just tell us? I'm actually not gonna be involved in the tour at all. I'm just going back to eat, so it's gonna be great.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:38

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:39

Yeah, any anything, honestly, anything is welcome. And yeah, just uh just keep talking about it, you know. And it's it's it's just wonderful. We're all rebels at heart. We ride motorcycles that's already made us an you know, yeah, instant rebel. But you know, we're doing something good, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:58

So there are

Big 2025 Plans For Global Impact

SPEAKER_00 1:11:59

really I I would love to make a plug for the things that I have planned for 2025, um, just in case it resonates with anybody, um, 2025 and beyond. So obviously we're gonna keep working with Kiki on Pakistan. The Rebels tour right now is a lot about going and experiencing the culture and meeting the schools and donating items like wheelchairs and water filters and solar panels, you know, personal solar panels to these groups. But I'm hoping to, like I said, do a solar install on one of the schools that could really use it. And I also gonna be rolling out a community motorcycle program. So the idea behind that is you donate motorcycles to like, you know, a handful, one, two, five motorcycles to a specific community or a specific nonprofit or a specific school or, you know, some group who could really use it. We're gonna go there, we're gonna donate the motorcycles. We are going to teach people how to ride the motorcycles. So, for example, the women that Kiki was talking about who are the teachers, they're volunteer teachers at this school, they have to walk up this crazy rocky hill every single day from their houses to the school and back. And so if we could teach them how to ride motorcycles and don't, I think there are like 10 teachers there, eight, 10 teachers, something like that. So if we could donate, like, I mean, even a handful of motorcycles, but if we could donate 10 motorcycles to this group, teach all the women how to ride them, and then teach basic mechanics, like this is how you do chain maintenance, this is how you do an oil change, like that type of thing. That is the holistic program that I want to set up in Pakistan and in Guatemala. That's what I'm going down there in February to scout, is that program? And I may have some either discounted or donated motorcycles set up for Guatemala, but I don't have anything set up for Pakistan yet.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:47

So a motorcycle cost between like $1,400 to $2,000, just so you know, that is a brand new.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:54

So if somebody is like, I need a tax write-off for the end of this year, I don't know when this podcast is coming out, coming out, but all of this is tax deductible. So if you make a $2,000 donation to Engines for Change and you say, I want this to go to the school in Pakistan, or the the program in Guatemala is supporting a nonprofit that you like teaches community members to collect trash in their area and build sustainably built schools using the waste. And they are, they need a couple motorcycles to be able to go do supply runs. Like when they need three nails, they can go pick up three nails and come right back, as opposed to that being an entire day of somebody walking and then coming back. So that's the group that we're working with in Guatemala. They're called Long Way Home, and then obviously Rebels in Pakistan. So if you wanted to donate $2,000 and you're like, I'm from Guatemala and I want to donate to that bike, or I want to donate to that service, or I love what Kihi's doing and I want to donate to the Pakistan, uh, you get a that's that's a tax write-off for you, right? And you get to donate a motorcycle to a teacher who needs it to be able to get to school in the morning, that type of thing. So if you have, if any of that resonates and you have the opportunity to connect us with bike suppliers in the areas, if you want to come train people on how to do operate, like how to do chain maintenance and oil changes, right? Like so many of us have those skills. But being able to like teach that to people would be huge. Or if you have ever been a motorcycle, like a basic rider instructor, and you want to come to Pakistan and be the person to teach them how to ride a motorcycle, those are all opportunities for people to like really get involved and make a difference. Yeah. If you have, like I said, bike suppliers would be huge. If you want to donate gear for, you know, the women so that they're geared up, they have helmets, like that type of thing. You know, we can we can set something like that up. So the idea is really to like launch this as a template. And there are people around the world who already do this in some capacity. So I mentioned the Boda Girls and the Tiba Foundation in Kenya. They already do this with women in Kenya. There's a group called Free W run by this woman, Alison, who's in France, and she does tours through like India and does community motorcycle programs there as well. So this is really taking like programs that already exist, working with the communities, like, you know, the concept already exists, working with the communities to roll that out and adapt it to the local cultures and local languages, and then hopefully be able to like build that up on a global scale so that we can be like, look, this, and obviously track all the data. I'm like, I come from a science background. So having baseline data and understanding how it changes things like literacy and job placement and workforce development and whatnot, to really be able to show what kind of impact motorcycles make, like all of that kind of stuff is stuff that I need help with. Cause it's just me and my board and our you know, very small handful of volunteers.

Ron 1:16:45

So two names popped up in my head, Charlie Borman and Ewan McGregor.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:51

Yeah, I know, right? If you anybody knows Charlie and Ewan, send them my way.

Ron 1:16:55

Long way home.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:58

Sounds like both Kiki. Why haven't you come to Ewan McGregor? He was having brunch at the bike shed. Like oh my god, we gotta talk.

Ron 1:17:09

Oh my goodness. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:11

I don't know how to do anything, guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:12

I just I'm the worst. Great, but also send it my way.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:15

Just shoot my my you know phone number and it'll be fine. We'll hang out. Well, no kidding.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:20

But yeah, Rebel Seur is launching really soon. Guys, I need you to know that like the focus is so much on like your immersion in everything, and that's why I've made this like a luxury tour. So that I mean, we've got chase vehicles, we've got mechanics, we've got the bikes, we've got everything. Like every like you you just show up. All you gotta do is show up, like I said, and everything is taken care of. From the second you land in Pakistan, you are king and a queen. Like, and so that's so wonderful because you can actually, you don't have to worry about all the little things that we worry about when we're, you know, riding through places like, oh God, I gotta load my bike, I gotta do this, I gotta do that. No, you are waiting on hand and foot. There's a day you don't feel like riding. Heck, we got we get to hire locals. I hire people who get paid in those 12 days of my tour, like a six-month to one year salary they make in those 12 days.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:13

And and that's only like that's not a lot of money. Like, yeah, it's not, yeah, it's not a lot of money. Like the tour is what, like just over $3,000 for 10 days or something? $3,600 and and everything's taken care of.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:27

There's nothing 12 days, it's really incredible. And all you focus on is having a blast, focusing on the roads, on the beauty, on the people you meet. Like, it's it's really different. Cause I've done the tours where you have to do everything your freaking self, and I'm like, ah, so I'm like, how can just everyone's focus just be on that? It changes the the it changes the experience for sure. But it's also a different experience. There's people who are like, I want to really rough it out. You're like, be my freaking guest. I'm 41, honey. Like, we can secure a tent for you. You can sleep outside, that's fine. Yeah, you're fine. But yeah, it's just it's really beautiful. Anyone who wants to help, even just even spending time with you today, Ron, has been so wonderful. What a way to end the week.

Joy, Guilt, And The Legacy Question

Ron 1:19:13

Same year, it's been wonderful. If I could share with you one thing that happened to me about 10 years ago, and I think it fits. So I was on an airplane flying from Denver to uh Puerto Vallarta in Mexico. And sitting across from me, I was sitting by myself at the time, but sitting across from me with this lady with her girlfriend, and we got talking a little bit, and I said, Oh, what are you doing? I mean, uh, what are you guys gonna do down in Puerto Vallarta? And she went on to say, Oh, this is my best friend. We've been best friends for a long time. We're gonna go down to the beach, we're gonna have few margaritas, we're just gonna chill. We just can't wait. Then she said, What are what are you gonna do? And I said, Oh, kind of the same thing, but I'm actually here with eight other guys. So there's nine of us, and we're kind of spread out in the plane. My buddies are back there, but we're landing in Puerto Vallarta, then we're gonna take a bus down to Manzanillo because a lady that's a member of our church, she started an orphanage down there to rescue street children. So she also does an outreach to the whole community as well, down there to heal, heal the children, heal the community. So, my friends and I, we brought some money with us, and we're gonna go down there and we're gonna give these gentlemen in Mexico, give the money to buy the materials to finish a drug and rehab, drug and alcohol rehab center that's down there. So we're gonna go do that. They're gonna, we're gonna give them the money, they're gonna buy all the goods, we're gonna help physically as much as we can, and then we're gonna go out on the beach and have our margarita. And she said, Oh, and nothing, nothing for the rest of the flight until we landed, starting to get up from our seats, and she looked at me so seriously, she said, You made me feel so guilty. And I said, I'm sorry. So here's my point.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:57

I think you can do it too, lady.

Ron 1:21:00

I think there's a huge difference between happiness and joy. She and her girlfriend are gonna have a happy time, they're gonna have a blast, they're gonna go home, life begins again. Me and my friends, we did experience joy. I was hugged by Mexican men who had nothing, hooked on drugs, had nothing, and just hugged and squeezed me and told me in Spanish, thank you. And we cried. And I've got that joy today, and I always have it to my deathbed. I'll bring up one other point to it. Again, I'm preaching. There's gonna come a day for all of us when people are gonna gather around and they're gonna talk about you. You're not gonna be there. Physically, maybe that's called your memorial service. And people are gonna talk about you. And what are they gonna say? They can say, Oh, Ron worked for court in corporate America. He was a manager and not sure what else he did. My hope is that they'll say he hosted a podcast and he cared about people, and hoped that the podcast would meet, would have wonderful people on who would spread their good news too that there is hope out there and there is need, and you can put both of those together and you can fix both of those too at the same time. We just have to spread the message.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:17

So yeah, it's so it's so easy. It's it's the easiest thing. If I can do it, like I said, with everything going on, what is everyone else's excuse? Make them guilty, Iran. Yeah, older.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:35

You're like, yeah, you're like, you're walking up, honey.

Ron 1:22:44

Maybe they should do that too. Thank you so both so much for not only not just being on, but for being really good people. I love, I just love hanging around people like you. I love you both. I don't know you very well, but I feel love for you. I really do. It's people like you. I really love because it's such a hurting world. People are killing themselves and they don't know that there are solutions. And the solution sometimes just taking a big step forward, taking a chance, and say, Can I really help somebody? Let me see if I can. And maybe we do it from the seat of a motorcycle, too. Who knows?

SPEAKER_03 1:23:20

Actually, there's a lot of non-riders who come on my tour because I want it to be for everyone. I'm not gonna stop someone who wants to do good just because they can't ride. It's like $750 cheaper for someone who wants to just like come in the chase feed. So I have made it like there's no excuse. Like, you know, even the people who do come and ride, they're like, oh, I'm not feeling it for the rest of the trip. And I'm like, guess what? That's what we have chase vehicles and trucks and comfortable, you know. So so that there's nothing that comes in the way of it. There's no excuse, there's no yeah, no shame, no nothing, rider or not, man, woman, trans, I've had everyone on my trip. It's for everyone.

Ron 1:24:03

I appreciate you both so much. And uh thank you so much for being on the podcast today.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:08

Thank you for having me. Thank you so much.

Final Thanks And Contact Info

Ron 1:24:13

You can hear it in their voices, can't you? A passion for empowering our motorcycling community to find joy, that elusive peace of mind, by demonstrating a love for others, the poor, the innocent, those who believe that nobody cares about them. Well, how can you demonstrate that you do? Well, volunteer or donate or both. If you're blessed to have the opportunity to ride a motorcycle and you've got that joy in your heart, well, let that turn into joy by supporting other people. Click the links in the show notes for details, or feel free to email me directly at ron at peacelovemoto.com. My thanks again to my friends Kiki and Kirsten. You too are an inspiration. As always, thank you for listening. And until we visit again, I wish you peace. I wish you love.